Curse

Karlos · Aug 13, 2007, 10:37 AM // 10:37

Hysteria on the side, I think that overall there has not been that big of a damage to the economy, that we know of. However, the real damage is to DoA economy.

Now that I know about it, I thikn this exploit was in effect for a week or two at least, however, the game's economy has been stable during those two weeks. Ecto prices went up when people thought Favor was lost forever and have gone down since then. However, there is no sign that duping was as widespread as some people think nor that it has damaged the overall economy much.

Of course, there is the chance that some people have stacks and stacks of other duped items in their storage and they're just waiting to use them.

However, for now, we know that the economy is ok. The only problem I see now is the economy of DoA with all those dime-a-dozen armbraces around.

spellsword · Aug 13, 2007, 10:37 AM // 10:37

A rollback would be the final blow to Anet. With EotN comming out soon, they simply can't afford it.

Tijger · Aug 13, 2007, 10:39 AM // 10:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by g r i m 7

All you people that would quit because of a Rollback are just plain selfish. You don't want to lose all YOUR little accomplishments but you don't look at the big picture here. Rollback would be the only thing to do right now until A-Net can think of something else to do.

They can't remove all the Torment Weps/Armbraces because most people sold them already and because some people actually spent their time and money getting them.

They can't make them untradable seeing as most people sold them for a lot of cash.

I don't see any other choise A-Net has other than to Rollback.

What exactly IS that big picture you are talking about here? The few people who've traded for armbraces of the vast majority to whom their 'little' accomplishments may mean an awful lot?

Talk about selfish. 99.9% of players have never even seen an armbrace, get over yourself, please, the majority doesnt care about your torment weps or armbraces and whether you did or didnt buy/sell them. The majority DOES care about losing all they worked for for a month to appease a relative few high end traders and farmers.

Bubba · Aug 13, 2007, 10:39 AM // 10:39

So many people here are talking about a rollback. Why would I want a rollback when I don't even care about DOA? How many people actually care about DOA? I doubt the majority of the GW population do.

A rollback is the easy way to do it for A-Net, but they should just do their work, investigate and ban the people responsible. A rollback of more then a few hours seems unrealistic to me in keeping people happy when looking at the majority of the GW population. Every reaction A-Net will undertake now will piss off some people, but the notion of a rollback is just ridiculous in my opinion when compared to the impact.

Just swing that little ban scepter around, people knew what they were getting into the moment they started abusing the glitch.

Shanaeri Rynale · Aug 13, 2007, 10:40 AM // 10:40

I doubt there will be a roll back. A few thousand armbraces is nothing compared to the backlash that would be faced by a rollback, esp over a festival weekend where people spent days on titles etc.

Talk of a month rollback is also out of the question, for the same reason.

All that will happen is that the armbraces in game at the moment will go down in price, more people will get shiny weapons and we'll move on. Torment weapons and armbraces were always going to decline in value in Gwen, so all this has done is sped up the process. The amount of extra guild bought into the economy is probably no more than people spend on ebay gold in that same period.

The impact of this, is less than the trader reset and trader bugs. What may happen is that they will close the servers for a while to ascertain the effects but thats all. Those players who were caught trying to buy stuff for 1000 armbraces will get banned, and this will be yesterdays news.

As for the red dye dupe, I believe they did it, otherwise why would AN disable reconnects?

mr_groovy · Aug 13, 2007, 10:41 AM // 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by g r i m 7

They can't remove all the Torment Weps/Armbraces because most people sold them already and because some people actually spent their time and money getting them.

I don't see any other choise A-Net has other than to Rollback.

Read thread == Win

ALL items could be duped. Ecto's, Gold items, Greens, Lockpicks, rare materials etc. Also there is no estimate time that the dupes were detected. So rollback wouldn't really be fair.

semantic · Aug 13, 2007, 10:42 AM // 10:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by g r i m 7

All you people that would quit because of a Rollback are just plain selfish. You don't want to lose all YOUR little accomplishments but you don't look at the big picture here. Rollback would be the only thing to do right now until A-Net can think of something else to do.

They can't remove all the Torment Weps/Armbraces because most people sold them already and because some people actually spent their time and money getting them.

They can't make them untradable seeing as most people sold them for a lot of cash.

I don't see any other choise A-Net has other than to Rollback.

People who spent their time/money getting torment gear legitimately will still have them tomorrow. No amount of duping can take them away from you or anybody else.

If there's a rollback, thousands and thousands of achievements would be undone. It would be stupid, and they won't do it 2 weeks before they launch their first product in a year.

Lykan · Aug 13, 2007, 10:44 AM // 10:44

Rollback? No chance..
Think about the last month for a second..
Dragon festival and afkers farmer, Double Fame W/end and Double Champ points w/end and prob some other pve stuff.

Wont happen people.

Zorgy · Aug 13, 2007, 10:44 AM // 10:44

It is crazy LOL 20 minutes after my previous post the rythm of wts & wtb has increased dramatically.

its like a crash at the stock exchange

WTS 500 ambraces 5k each omfg LOL

And some chinese ads as well with a tel n° or a long line of figures.

evilkingsky · Aug 13, 2007, 10:45 AM // 10:45

You guys are all talking about "who cares about armbraces", but what about the dupers who have stockpiled up a bunch of ectos or rubies in their inventory waiting to sell at a later time. I hope theres a way to just delete all duped items, but if not a short rollback does sound reasonable (a week or less). It would probably remove a majority of duped items because this exploit seems to have gotten alot of activity only recently.

g r i m 7 · Aug 13, 2007, 10:47 AM // 10:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tijger

What exactly IS that big picture you are talking about here? The few people who've traded for armbraces of the vast majority to whom their 'little' accomplishments may mean an awful lot?

Talk about selfish. 99.9% of players have never even seen an armbrace, get over yourself, please, the majority doesnt care about your torment weps or armbraces and whether you did or didnt buy/sell them. The majority DOES care about losing all they worked for for a month to appease a relative few high end traders and farmers.

Get over MYSELF. Your the one that thinks your all high and mighty. But enough about that, I dont even HAVE A torment weapon, Nor do I want one. I'm perfectly fine with my greens. I'm all about fairness in this game. Is it fair that a few hundred people made MILLIONS while the rest of the game is Mildly poor? No. Most people are concerned about their titles and shit but they wont even lend a noob a measly 50g because they are that selfish. This game needs to be fair for ALL people, not just the ones that exploit glitches and bugs in the system.

VOTE ROLLBACK!!!

Chris Blackstar · Aug 13, 2007, 10:48 AM // 10:48

why rollback anything? You want to stop the dupe bullshit, then just don't except armbraces as payment for any trade. Another thing, stop inflation the prices of items by adding ecto's or some other rare material to drive the price beyond 100K. All the traders out there who started that crap are the one's responsible for the current state the game and economy is in right now.

The only other way to solve this crap is to come out with a new monitary unit, example: 1000g=1plat 100plat=1 chaos crystal Make the last unit a item that does not drop, or stack and is only avalable from a game banker for 100K

Traveller · Aug 13, 2007, 10:48 AM // 10:48

I'm interested in seeing how far they can track the duplicates. If you trade a duplicated item for a tormented weapon and sell it on, there's potentially a heck of a lot of people getting the short end of these trades if they reset them all.

jrk247 · Aug 13, 2007, 10:50 AM // 10:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by g r i m 7

Get over MYSELF. Your the one that thinks your all high and mighty. But enough about that, I dont even HAVE A torment weapon, Nor do I want one. I'm perfectly fine with my greens. I'm all about fairness in this game. Is it fair that a few hundred people made MILLIONS while the rest of the game is Mildly poor? No. Most people are concerned about their titles and shit but they wont even lend a noob a measly 50g because they are that selfish. This game needs to be fair for ALL people, not just the ones that exploit glitches and bugs in the system.

VOTE ROLLBACK!!!

So that makes it fair to all the players that had no word of this exploit and have been playing the game as they normally would?

Chunk · Aug 13, 2007, 10:52 AM // 10:52

Finally the game is collapsing!

now I can get back to Real Life.

It's been a good run everyone. See you in Hell!

Shanaeri Rynale · Aug 13, 2007, 10:52 AM // 10:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by semantic

People who spent their time/money getting torment gear legitimately will still have them tomorrow. No amount of duping can take them away from you or anybody else.

If there's a rollback, thousands and thousands of achievements would be undone. It would be stupid, and they won't do it 2 weeks before they launch their first product in a year.

Agreed. Back in December, my torment staff cost me 2m. Do I regret it, nope not at all. Firstly it was only pretend money, secondly I've had 8 months or more enjoying using and and thirdly it was always going to devalue.

As soon as you realise that this will happen to whatever item you farm for,make or buy the more fun things will be.

Patrick Smit · Aug 13, 2007, 10:52 AM // 10:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by strcpy

We also do not what constitutes and "item" in their code - there is no reason why they can not have a semi-unique identifier. Then again, there is no specific reason why they do either.

I know in a past project I worked we needed some way to keep thing mostly seperate - a collision was to be somewhat avoided but wasn't really bad. We added a 16 bit identifier that was a hash of several things (process ID and time stamp). The assumption was that this gave is 65538 identifiers and that was enough even under excessive load - models showed that we had a collision something like once every few million runs under twice the estimated top load and a collision just meant that it tried again.

So, does anet doe something similar? That is one byte per item, heck even if they went with one bit the chances of having 1250 Ambraces of Truth with all the same state is pretty much zero - yet a dupe would do so. Were I to do an online game and this did not cause a storage cost issue (and it may very well, I do not know their margins) it would be something I would add, especially on higher cost items. Though it would be much more difficult to do with stackable items, I would be fairly surprised if the dupers limited it to just them.

I suspect they don't have it, stacks are convenient item compression methods, and therefore are likely without such a state identifier. But I agree with you that it would be good to put identifiers on items in future games. People will complain about it that it is invading their "privacy" like they do with DNA databases. But databases that contain mostly or only physical visible traits (clustered together in the genome) would be unusable by outsiders but very informative and useful against crime as identifiers of individuals.

Bubba · Aug 13, 2007, 10:54 AM // 10:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by g r i m 7

Get over MYSELF. Your the one that thinks your all high and mighty. But enough about that, I dont even HAVE A torment weapon, Nor do I want one. I'm perfectly fine with my greens. I'm all about fairness in this game. Is it fair that a few hundred people made MILLIONS while the rest of the game is Mildly poor? No. Most people are concerned about their titles and shit but they wont even lend a noob a measly 50g because they are that selfish. This game needs to be fair for ALL people, not just the ones that exploit glitches and bugs in the system.

VOTE ROLLBACK!!!

Oh yes, it's really fair to rollback everyone just because of a few. Punish the guilty, not everyone. I don't give a rats ass if someone has more gold then I do, but I do care if I get punished because he did something wrong to get there. Look at what your saying, you want to punish EVERYONE for, as you say yourself, a few hundred. How is that fair?

evilkingsky · Aug 13, 2007, 10:54 AM // 10:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Blackstar

why rollback anything? You want to stop the dupe bullshit, then just don't except armbraces as payment for any trade. Another thing, stop inflation the prices of items by adding ecto's or some other rare material to drive the price beyond 100K. All the traders out there who started that crap are the one's responsible for the current state the game and economy is in right now.

The only other way to solve this crap is to come out with a new monitary unit, example: 1000g=1plat 100plat=1 chaos crystal Make the last unit a item that does not drop, or stack and is only avalable from a game banker for 100K

but there's already some people who have made millions by selling duped items. even if everybody were to stop accepting armbraces as payment now, the dupers would be filthy rich already. Just leave them be?

Hyper.nl · Aug 13, 2007, 10:55 AM // 10:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karlos

Hysteria on the side, I think that overall there has not been that big of a damage to the economy, that we know of. However, the real damage is to DoA economy.

Now that I know about it, I thikn this exploit was in effect for a week or two at least, however, the game's economy has been stable during those two weeks. Ecto prices went up when people thought Favor was lost forever and have gone down since then. However, there is no sign that duping was as widespread as some people think nor that it has damaged the overall economy much.

Of course, there is the chance that some people have stacks and stacks of other duped items in their storage and they're just waiting to use them.

However, for now, we know that the economy is ok. The only problem I see now is the economy of DoA with all those dime-a-dozen armbraces around.

Not only armbraces could be duped. Who knows what else has been duped. Most likely candidates are rare minipets, Rubies, Sapphires, Diamonds, Ecto's, Superior vigor runes. All of these have been dropped in price a lot. Maybe afterall the loot scaling/hard mode update was not the only thing that was responsible for the large overall price drop. But we can't know this yet.